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03368
140.0 艸
SC=9, FS=2 TS=13

SAT-08693
Kept in M-set, IRG 61.
IDS=⿱艹⿷見厶, 2023-04.
TS=13, IRG 58.
Similar To: Similar: 萈 (U+8408)/莧 (U+83A7)/莞 (U+839E)/
U+8408U+8408
U+83A7U+83A7
U+839EU+839E
Attributes:



Review Comments

Type
Description
Submitter
Attributes
ATTRIBUTES_TC
WS2021 v2.0
[ Resolved ]
Change TC to 13.
Ken LUNDE
UTC
2021-11-27 00:53:17 UTC
Attributes
ATTRIBUTES_IDS
WS2021 v2.0
[ Resolved ]
Change IDS to ⿱艹⿷見厶.
Ken LUNDE
UTC
2021-11-27 00:54:09 UTC
Attributes
ATTRIBUTES_IDS
WS2021 v3.0
[ Resolved ]
Should the IDS be changed from ⿺莧厶 to ⿱艹⿷見厶 or ⿷莧厶?
HKSAR
Hong Kong
2022-07-06 07:34:45 UTC
Data for Unihan
SEMANTIC_VARIANT
WS2021 v3.0
The evidence says the meaning is "to form a soundless smile" and quotes a passage from the Analects, which is now more commonly rendered: 夫子莞爾而笑, so this is apparently interchangeable with 莞 (U+839E) which also describes a type of smile. The meanings of 莞 also overlap with 萈 (U+8408) and 莧 (U+83A7), which dictionaries such as Kangxi cite as semantic variants. Might consider unification with 萈 (U+8408) or 莧 (U+83A7) based on similar shape.
Lee COLLINS
Vietnam
2022-07-06 15:52:51 UTC
Unification
UNIFICATION
WS2021 v5.0
[ Unresolved ]
U+8408
U+83A7
Potential unification to 萈 (U+8408) or 莧 (U+83A7) based on comment #7764 (which seems to be marked as Data for Unihan instead of Unification in error).
Henry CHAN
Individual
2023-04-08 20:33:58 UTC
Unification
UNIFICATION
WS2021 v5.0
[ Unresolved ]
U+96B8
U+4E00
Referring to the description of 隸經雜著甲編(卷6) "釋莞", the characters "莞 (U+839E)", "萈 (U+8408)", and "莧 (U+83A7)" were interchangeable in the past. And 隸經雜著甲編 mentioned that 一切經音義 was written as “夫子萈爾而笑”. Therefore, the proposed character is highly likely originated from "萈 (U+8408)".

《隸經雜著甲編》(顧震福。光緖壬辰季冬刊板[1892])
Conifer TSENG
TCA
2023-07-21 02:27:38 UTC
Unification
NO_UNIFICATION
WS2021 v5.0
[ Unresolved ]
We maintain that it should be kept separated from 萈.

- The right bottom part 厶 is so strikingly different from 丶 in 楷書 that suggests structural difference
- It is used in a cite from 蒼頡篇, which might be related to its original shape
- The glyph is very unique that we couldn't find similar ones even in 異體字字典. Given it consists of elemental components of 見 and 厶 while the glyph is rare, few would be expected to look up this glyph using 萈; unifying with 萈 rather impedes searchers' usability.

As far as we know, the SAT database contain no other 萈 occurrences and all 莧 seem to be the name of a vegetable (xiàn).
WANG Yifan
SAT
2023-10-18 10:54:47 UTC
Other
OTHER
WS2021 v5.0
[ Unresolved ]
Similar alternations between 丶 and 厶 include U+5154 兔 and U+2A781 𪞁; and U+26351 𦍑 and U+7F97 羗.
Andrew WEST
UK
2023-10-18 11:42:00 UTC

Meeting Minutes

DateDescription
IRG #61
2023-10-17 (Tue)
8:31 am -0400
Recorded by CHEN Zhuang
pending for off line discussion.
IRG #61
2023-10-18 (Wed)
1:05 pm -0400
Recorded by CHEN Zhuang
kept in M set.

Attribute Changes

VersionDescription
3.0
For 03368, change Total Stroke Count to 13
3.0
For 03368, add Discussion Record "TS=13, IRG 58."
5.0
For 03368, add Discussion Record "IDS=⿱艹⿷見厶, 2023-04."
5.0
For 03368, change IDS to ⿱艹⿷見厶
6.0
For 03368, add Discussion Record "Kept in M-set, IRG 61."

Glyph Changes

Source ReferenceGlyph
SAT-08693
1.0

Raw Info
groupSAT
a) Source referenceSAT-08693
b) PUA Code of TTFF248
c) KangXi Radical Code(Primary)140.0
d) Stroke Count(Primary)9
e) First Stroke(Primary)2
g) Total Stroke Sount12
i) IDS (Ideographic Description Sequence)⿺莧厶
j) Similar/ Variants Similar: 萈/莧/莞/
k) Ref. to Evidence docSAT-08693-01.jpg;SAT-08693-02.jpg;SAT-08693-03.jpg
l) Optional infoN/A
m1)Previous IRG WSN/A
m2)Sequence No of Previous IRG WSN/A